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more help, please

Discussion in 'Technique' started by pianolady, May 12, 2008.

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  1. pianolady

    pianolady Monica Hart, Administrator Staff Member Piano Society Artist Trusted Member

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    This is kind of strange. Look at the second measure. How do you accent a tied note? I'm sure pushing down hard of the the already depressed keys will not work. Or maybe I'm supposed to nod my head there to 'look' like an accent? :lol: :lol:

    Any ideas?

    [​IMG]
     
    pianolady, May 12, 2008
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  2. alf

    alf Active Member Piano Society Artist

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    Yes, this could be not an accent, but a diminuendo inflection. See the controversial diminuendo/accent notation in Schubert's music. Dunno, just a possible explanation. Written that way you can only mimic the accent, not actually play it. Who's the composer?
     
    alf, May 12, 2008
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  3. pianolady

    pianolady Monica Hart, Administrator Staff Member Piano Society Artist Trusted Member

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    It's Granados.

    Thanks, Alfonso. But I do not understand what "mimic the accent' means.
     
    pianolady, May 12, 2008
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  4. alf

    alf Active Member Piano Society Artist

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    I'd have bet good money on it. :lol:

    Sorry, I meant you have to mime the accent.

    At any rate, I actually have no clues and hope someone can shed light on that odd sign, I'm just curious now.
     
    alf, May 12, 2008
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  5. Terez

    Terez New Member

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    I've played something before (I want to say it was Rachmaninoff) that had a crescendo marked on a sustained chord. As if! :lol:

    Maybe Granados wrote that for clavichord?
     
    Terez, May 12, 2008
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  6. pianolady

    pianolady Monica Hart, Administrator Staff Member Piano Society Artist Trusted Member

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    [​IMG]

    Ok, I'll try almost anything. :lol: :lol:


    Sorry, Alf. I still don't really get this. But I'll let you know if I ever learn the answer.

    That's pretty much the same thing as my accent over a tied note. Who knows...
     
    pianolady, May 13, 2008
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  7. alf

    alf Active Member Piano Society Artist

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    Beethoven and Schumann also have "unplayable" dynamic indications. For example the cresc. at ms.254 in the first movement of the Les Adieux sonata.
     
    alf, May 13, 2008
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  8. Terez

    Terez New Member

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    My version (Schenker) says it's measure 252, but I see that. :D That's a matter of first and second endings...my textbook anthologies all count the measures of first and second endings as the same measures, which is what this version did.
     
    Terez, May 13, 2008
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  9. pianolady

    pianolady Monica Hart, Administrator Staff Member Piano Society Artist Trusted Member

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    That Les Adieux one doesn't seem too odd to me. Basically, isn't it just crescendoing from 251 to the end?

    [​IMG]
     
    pianolady, May 13, 2008
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  10. alf

    alf Active Member Piano Society Artist

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    Yes, a crescendo of two notes, the first of which is the resolution of an appoggiatura... pretty awkward isn't it?
     
    alf, May 13, 2008
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  11. PJF

    PJF New Member Piano Society Artist

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    I could be wrong but I think the accented notes are played. Perhaps the ties are interpreted as a tenuto?

    It could be an engraver's error.
     
    PJF, May 14, 2008
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  12. pianolady

    pianolady Monica Hart, Administrator Staff Member Piano Society Artist Trusted Member

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    There are tons of errors in the book I'm using, so that makes sense. Thanks, Pete.
     
    pianolady, May 14, 2008
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  13. Terez

    Terez New Member

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    Don't you have a recording of the piece, Monica?
     
    Terez, May 14, 2008
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  14. pianolady

    pianolady Monica Hart, Administrator Staff Member Piano Society Artist Trusted Member

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    I do now. Just forked over another .99 cents to itunes to hear de Larrocha play this. (been doing this a lot lately!) Anyway, I could hear no accent on this spot in the music, so it must be an error. You wouldn't believe how many errors I have found. Most of them are missing accidentals, but in this piece there is also a place where there are repeat signs but no indication of where to go back to. I like mysteries, but I'm kind of getting tired of trying to figure out how these Granados pieces are supposed to be played!

    Thanks for your help, Terez, Alf and Pete. :)
     
    pianolady, May 14, 2008
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  15. PJF

    PJF New Member Piano Society Artist

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    Say, is there an authoritative edition of Granados's music? An Urtext if you will?
     
    PJF, May 16, 2008
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  16. pianolady

    pianolady Monica Hart, Administrator Staff Member Piano Society Artist Trusted Member

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    If there is, I'd like to know. But I doubt it. I've listened to so many players play his pieces and they are all so different from one another. I suppose de Larrocha would play the most 'authentic' music, but still...it would be nice to see it in print. I'm using a Dover edition and never checked other editions. Thanks for giving me the idea, Pete. :wink:
     
    pianolady, May 16, 2008
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  17. techneut

    techneut Active Member Piano Society Artist Trusted Member

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    The complete edition edited by Douglas Riva should be pretty reliable, seeing as he worked closely with Larrocha.
     
    techneut, May 16, 2008
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  18. pianolady

    pianolady Monica Hart, Administrator Staff Member Piano Society Artist Trusted Member

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    Why am I always the last one to find out about these things?:x I didn't even know there was a Riva edition. :oops:

    I sure am glad that I hang around with such smart people. :D I'll check out the book very soon!
     
    pianolady, May 16, 2008
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  19. PJF

    PJF New Member Piano Society Artist

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    I was also unaware of a Larrocha/Riva edition.

    Apparently, it IS the urtext edition, if anyone finds it online, let us all know!
     
    PJF, May 17, 2008
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  20. pianolady

    pianolady Monica Hart, Administrator Staff Member Piano Society Artist Trusted Member

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    Oh, yes, Pete. That's it! I'm so excited. Just found the complete set on a Spanish music publishers website and struggled with working out the money conversion of the various volumes. But then I found them at sheetmusicplus.com

    here is the direct link:

    http://www.sheetmusicplus.com/store/smp ... 0984429714


    The $740 dollars for the complete set shocked me, and I'm sure my husband will not let me order it. But I don't want every volume. Only 8 of them, so I'm going to order two at time to avoid suspicion.
     
    pianolady, May 17, 2008
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