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Haydn Sonata in D Major, Hob. XVI/33

Discussion in 'Submission Room' started by jlr43, Nov 16, 2011.

  1. jlr43

    jlr43 Member Piano Society Artist

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    Hello,

    Another sonata in my Haydn repertoire recording project. An oft-neglected but IMO delightful early/middle sonata. The first movement exhibits a characteristically Haydnesque ebullience and affability, while the second is one of the more wholeheartedly romantic of the composer's middle movements. The lack of tonic resolution at the end of the Adagio actually represents an attaca into the third movement minuet, but since they are recorded on separate tracks, I guess the ears will have to hold the thought :p

    Thanks for listening,

    Joe

    Haydn - Sonata in D major, Hob. XVI Nr. 33, I: Allegro

    Haydn - Sonata in D major, Hob. XVI Nr. 33, II: Adagio

    Haydn - Sonata in D major, Hob. XVI Nr. 33, III: Tempo di Minuetto
     
  2. techneut

    techneut Active Member Piano Society Artist

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    Once again excellent playing. Better yet IMO than the previous one. I sense that ornaments don't come easily on your instrument. What make was it again ? Not the digital you use for your Youtube recordings I think ? (BTW do fix that camera angle....)

    I noted two strange rhythmic glitches in the first mvt at 1:22 and 3:00 but I don't have the score here so maybe it is what Haydn intended.
    The last part of the Minuet is nice but IMO the closing chords are too loud and assertive.
     
  3. pianolady

    pianolady Monica Hart, Administrator Staff Member Piano Society Artist

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    Very nice and clean, Joe. I like how every note is spot-on and you remain so steady. Do you record with a metronmoe?

    I agree about the camera angle. Sort of strange. Also, why do you make videos on a digital anyway? They would be much more impressive on an acoustic grand. You look a little sad in this setup.

    Chris, I can put these up later.
     
  4. jlr43

    jlr43 Member Piano Society Artist

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    Thanks for listening, Chris and Monica.

    It's a Steinway Concert B (7 foot, next size down from the 9-foot D). The piano is nice and even now that the action has been redone (three years ago), but the new action is quite heavy. We talked to the technician about possibly lightening it, but he said that could hurt the repeating mechanism (funny, since that can be difficult anyway because of the heaviness :p ). I like therefore that the ornaments generally sound even (and I've worked fairly hard on trills in the past), but sometimes a note or two doesn't sound quite come out the way I like. It may be a problem too just with the modern piano in general, there being so many ornaments in these earlier Haydn sonatas (later on, he uses many fewer trills and the ones he does employ tend to be more pianistic).

    You're right. I rush the last beat of the left hand against the right hand cadential trills. I've noted that too as a bad habit of mine in the past with Mozart and Haydn. I'll keep that more in mind for future.

    Thanks, Monica. I never record with a metronome and don't generally practice with one, although I do find the metronome very useful for reining in certain passages. Sometimes when I initially record something, my tendency is to rush, and so in relistening and rethinking, I'll use the metronome to check the passage or movement in question. I find this particularly useful with Bach, etudes, and classic-period music, where IMO the overall rhythmic focus is on an exact pulse.

    I'm a newbie (started this year) at video recording, so I'm not sure how to record an acoustic and get good sound (my Sony digital camera has IMO great picture but poor sound). The basic good thing about recording the digial is that it's easy :p I just record directly into the computer on Audacity and then I sync up the video and audio on my video editing program. Regarding the camera itself, it's on a tripod perched on my desk, which is next to my computer and of course has a lot of other crap on it :D. Anyway, any advice either of you has about angle or getting good audio sound with an acoustic setup or anything video-related would of course be much appreciated.

    Thanks,

    Joe
     
  5. Rachfan

    Rachfan Active Member Piano Society Artist

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    Hi Joe

    I just listened to the sonata. The first movement has that Haydnesque exuberance for sure. I especially liked the quiet Adagio--beautiful! While listening to the Minuet, at 2:28 it almost sounds as though the mic position was changed. It seemed like a shift of balanced R-L volume levels toward a right channel bias there. Anyway, it's easy to tell that you have an affinity for this music, not only from the fact that you've studied all these sonatas, but more from the care you take in performing these works. Very fine playing, Joe.

    David
     
  6. jlr43

    jlr43 Member Piano Society Artist

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    Thanks very much for listening, David. I'm glad you liked it. On my present project, I have six of the sonatas done (recorded over the past couple of months) Of course, I don't want to overload listeners -- or overwork the admins :lol: So i've so far been submitting one every week or so. I'm glad that my enthusiasm for Haydn, who has always been my favorite of the "Big Three" classical composers, continues to show thus far.

    Thanks, too, for pointing out that glitch. Something happened with the balance in post-processing it appears. I fiddled with it a bit and reattached above (actually ended up reattaching all three movements so that the minuet would appear last) and think I improved it (?).
     
  7. pianolady

    pianolady Monica Hart, Administrator Staff Member Piano Society Artist

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    Ok, these are up, Joe. Regarding video recording tips: I have two cameras and both of them do not have good sound (I'd like to get a new camera one of these days)(but even so, I doubt a camera would give that great of a sound anyway), so I record with the camera and also my Edirol recorder. Then swap out the camera audio with the Edirol file in the post-processing. The camera angle is askew in your videos - like you intentionally made it look crooked. All you have to do is set your camera at a level so that you don't cut off your head and then look thru the lens to see if the image is level.
     
  8. Rachfan

    Rachfan Active Member Piano Society Artist

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    Hi Joe,

    That spot sounds pretty much the same to me, but in the scheme of things, it's not enough of a glitch to be a detractor. I wouldn't worry about it.

    David
     
  9. jlr43

    jlr43 Member Piano Society Artist

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    Hi,

    Could you replace the versions on the site with these? I think I've fixed that spot David was talking about and I made a couple of other small edits as well to the other two movements. Sorry for the inconvenience. I generally try not to make a habit of this so soon after submitting, but am not always successful :)

    Thanks,

    Joe
     
  10. andrew

    andrew Member Piano Society Artist

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    Very nice to hear this. I think Haydn is shamefully neglected by most pianists. I particularly enjoyed the rhythmic aspects and sense of dialogue between phrases in the first movement. Throughout, the playing is distinguished by commendable attention to articulation and clarity: excellent!
     
  11. pianolady

    pianolady Monica Hart, Administrator Staff Member Piano Society Artist

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    Ok, I've replaced the files. The links at the top of this thread are your new files.
     
  12. jlr43

    jlr43 Member Piano Society Artist

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    Yes. I was surprised to see that there weren't more Haydn sonatas on the site (given that there are over 50 after all :p ) Haydn may be less immediate in some ways than Mozart and Beethoven, but for me it's generally fresher and more novel (at least the keyboard works).

    Thanks very much for listening, Andrew.
     
  13. jlr43

    jlr43 Member Piano Society Artist

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    Thanks, Monica.
     
  14. hreichgott

    hreichgott New Member

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    Nice recording! I do love this sonata and am about to take it into the studio myself in a couple of weeks.

    May I ask a question about the ornaments in the score you're working from? I have a variety of mordents, inverted mordents, and turns that sound different from yours. For example, at the beginning of the development section of the 1st mvt I have in the RH melody: turn, inverted mordent, inverted mordent, turn. Sounds like you have trill, inverted mordent, inverted mordent, trill.
    Actually, the other spot that sounded odd to me was also trills instead of turns--in the 8 bars before the repeat I have several turns which sound like trills in your recording.
    What edition do you have?

    thanks from another student of the brilliant Haydn!
    hreichgott

    PS I am aware that ornamentation can often be very individual and up to the performer, but my understanding is that for Haydn I should be very specific about which ornaments to use.
     
  15. jlr43

    jlr43 Member Piano Society Artist

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    Hello hreichgott and thanks for listening.

    I use the Schott Universal Wiener Urtext edition and I do have the same markings as yours. Regarding the turns at the conclusion of the exposition, I do play turns and begin them on the upper-neighbor notes (the C# and F#). For the ones at the beginning of the development, I play turns also but begin them on the principal note. I double-checked just to make sure I was playing turns but it could also be they're not as clear as they should be :p

    I think that's true -- to a point. On the modern piano, since the number of ornaments are quite challenging in Haydn and Scarlatti, for example, ornaments are often left out altogether depending on the instrument and performer. Or sometimes they are shortened, which I think is also fine depending on context (I do try to be a purist, though, and do all the ones indicated even given the heaviness of the action). What I find to be one of the most important issues in playing ornaments in classic-period music, though, is the melodic direction. They should fit in with the melodic line as if the ornament wasn't there at all and should not distract from the melodic flow, which is why I will begin certain of them on the principal note and certain on the upper note.

    I hope this helps. Good luck with your own recording and thanks again for listening.

    Joe
     
  16. musicrecovery

    musicrecovery Member Piano Society Artist

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    Hello Joe,

    First movement: The broken arpeggios and ornaments are very rich and sound both wild and beautifully controlled at the same time. There is an almost Scarlatti like feel to the ornamentation. The melodies are slightly punctuated with accents throughout, making them seem voice like. The tempo is interesting.

    Second movement: Very nice conception of the main motif. The scale like passages were very melodic. Sweet and pleasant to listen to, the second movement with it's delicate and yet forthright texture is charmingly convincing.

    Third movement: This is very beautiful, very musical, precise, and well balanced. Bravo to you performance of the entire Sonata.

    Thanks for sharing,
    -Kaila
     
  17. rsmullyan

    rsmullyan New Member Piano Society Artist

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    Excellent!
     
  18. Rachfan

    Rachfan Active Member Piano Society Artist

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    Hi,

    Regarding Haydn being neglected today: I recall when I was a young piano student, good piano teachers at the time used to sequence the Classical period by introducing the student to Haydn, Mozart and then early Beethoven. It makes me wonder if today's teachers might be skipping over Haydn and going directly to Mozart. For whatever reason, it seems that only a few of these Haydn sonatas are widely known which is unfortunate.

    David
     
  19. jlr43

    jlr43 Member Piano Society Artist

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    Thanks for listening, Kaila, and for the compliments. I agree that the ornamentation and overall sound of some of these earlier sonatas is Scarlattiesque.

    Joe
     
  20. jlr43

    jlr43 Member Piano Society Artist

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    Thanks, rsmullyan.
     

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