DONATION STATUS
Needed before 2016-12-31
$ 2,500
So far donated
$ 750

Czerny...speed??

Discussion in 'Technique' started by Casper89, Aug 15, 2006.

  1. Casper89

    Casper89 New Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2006
    Messages:
    151
    Likes Received:
    0
    Last Name:
    Bronner
    First Name:
    Friedemann
    At which speed do you play czerny when you finish an etude.....I'm trying the first etudes of op.299, and i've made a midifile with the speed that czerny has written. for the first one 216 or s.th like that...well, i listened to it, and noticed that it is an amazing speed!!! i never will be able to reach this speed!! does this mean that theses etudes are too difficult for me? Has anyone made recordings of them??
     
  2. robert

    robert New Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2006
    Messages:
    1,842
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Sweden
    Home Page:
    Last Name:
    Stahlbrand
    First Name:
    Robert
    WEBSITE:
    http://pianosociety.com
    WLM:
    robertstahlbrand@hotmail.com
    LOCATION:
    Sweden
    His etudes are generally marked to be played very fast but have a simple structure. I believe that one can have as a final goal to play them in the indicated speed while very few people actually can do that.

    If you take the first lesson as an example where a half-note is to be played 108 (b=216 as you say), playing 16:ths in that speed means that you need to hit 216/60*4 keys/second = 14.4 /keys per second.

    While Czerny's lessons can be a great improvement to achieve speed, they can be terrible frustrating and can even do harm unless you do it right. Never feel tensed but rather focus on playing them correct but slow and speed will come naturally. It is not for certain that you ever will be able to play them in speed but I think (if you are inspired) you should continue try them out. I also believe that you should consult a teacher to help you approach them.

    Remember, Czerny was Liszt's first "real" teacher so the exercises cannot be terrible wrong ;).
     
  3. techneut

    techneut Active Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2006
    Messages:
    9,930
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Last Name:
    Breemer
    First Name:
    Chris
    LOCATION:
    Netherlands
    I think Czerny was (in)famous for his fast metronome marks. Just look at the speeds he prescribed in his edition of the Well Tempered Clavier. You should not feel too daunted by them. As Robert says it is more important to play thse etudes well at a speed you are comfortable with. Once that comes naturally, the speed can be increased little by little - if necessary, that is.
     
  4. robert

    robert New Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2006
    Messages:
    1,842
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Sweden
    Home Page:
    Last Name:
    Stahlbrand
    First Name:
    Robert
    WEBSITE:
    http://pianosociety.com
    WLM:
    robertstahlbrand@hotmail.com
    LOCATION:
    Sweden
    As well as the Bach Inventions. I think that the speed he suggests ruins much of the beauty and power in Bach. At least my brain gets bored with it.
     
  5. techneut

    techneut Active Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2006
    Messages:
    9,930
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Last Name:
    Breemer
    First Name:
    Chris
    LOCATION:
    Netherlands
    And wasn't Czerny a pupil of Beethoven, who was also (in)famous for his ridiculous metronome marks ? Makes me wonder how he (Beethoven) played the WTC.....
     
  6. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    please don't follow those pedantically; it spoils the piece.

    Play it until you believe you have a firm grasp of the piece, and that you learned some technical mastery from the piece - what more could you ask for?

    I've played Czerny's 299 etudes, and I didn't even try to reach that speed. Just play some appropriate speed.
     
  7. Casper89

    Casper89 New Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2006
    Messages:
    151
    Likes Received:
    0
    Last Name:
    Bronner
    First Name:
    Friedemann
    thanks for the answers, they helped me a lot :)
     
  8. robert

    robert New Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2006
    Messages:
    1,842
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Sweden
    Home Page:
    Last Name:
    Stahlbrand
    First Name:
    Robert
    WEBSITE:
    http://pianosociety.com
    WLM:
    robertstahlbrand@hotmail.com
    LOCATION:
    Sweden
    Actually, beethoven once stated "Who needs a metronome? You feel the speed." Perhaps he needed one after all ;).
     
  9. lol_nl

    lol_nl New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2006
    Messages:
    170
    Likes Received:
    0
    My teacher tells me to play Czerny ridiculous fast (and good of course). Because Czerny is not so musical she wants me to train to be able to play fast. The opposite of what she wants me to do with Bach. Maybe a Bach-good-and-comfortable-Czerny-ridiculous-fast-combination works....
     
  10. techneut

    techneut Active Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2006
    Messages:
    9,930
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Last Name:
    Breemer
    First Name:
    Chris
    LOCATION:
    Netherlands
    I think it helps your technique and assurance to be able to play things much faster than they should be played. The danger may be that it becomes a habit.
     

Share This Page