DONATION STATUS
Needed before 2016-12-31
$ 2,500
So far donated
$ 860

Chopin Nocturne 32/1 and Nocturne in c-minor

Discussion in 'Submission Room' started by pianolady, May 2, 2007.

  1. pianolady

    pianolady Monica Hart, Administrator Staff Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2006
    Messages:
    8,716
    Likes Received:
    1
    Last Name:
    Hart
    First Name:
    Monica
    Sorry about all the nocturnes lately, but these two just got ready before other things I'm working on. First, some explanations: The 32/1 - I may be the only person around who plays the ending like this (on a B-Major chord). But it is in my book, and I do like a happy ending. Leonald has also recorded this nocturne, (we discussed this when he put it up) and he played it very well too, I might add, so this could be like an alternate. Maybe it can be listed as the 'happy ending' version. :)

    The second piece, the Nocturne in c-minor, is sort of a mystery - to me, anyway. I found it buried in a pile of music, I know I printed it off the internet some time ago but can't remember from where, it's only three pages long, and isn't even marked as being by Chopin but I sure hope it is. I've looked everywhere for information on it and found only one place that does list it as Chopin's and that it was composed late in his life, sometime in the late 1840's. This too is strange, because this nocturne is much more simplistic than all the other nocturnes so I would have thought it to be composed when he was young. But maybe he was just having one of those 'melancholy' days and maybe not feeling well, either, and this is all he could do that time. I don't know...if anyone has any more information on this, please let me know.

    Aside from all that, hope you enjoy these, and yes- it's is really me. :wink:

    Chopin - Nocturne Op. 32, No. 1
    Chopin - Nocturne in c-minor
     
  2. johnmar78

    johnmar78 New Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2006
    Messages:
    647
    Likes Received:
    0
    Occupation:
    Food chemist / pianist
    Location:
    Sydney, Australia
    Home Page:
    Last Name:
    Mar
    First Name:
    John
    Monica,
    sounds really good to me. And this is a genuie recording.... :lol:
     
  3. MindenBlues

    MindenBlues New Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2006
    Messages:
    692
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Germany
    Home Page:
    Last Name:
    Schmidt
    First Name:
    Olaf
    Both nocturnes sound beautiful to me!

    In your recordings no notes are uncertain, also the bass notes are clearly audible and give a strong base - very well.

    You really are a profound piano player to get it managed to record high quality pieces one after the other in short time!

    The posthumus Nocturne sounds indeed way frugal to me, but typical Chopinesque on the other side. The end of 32/1 I find very strange from the composition, but also audacious. What must people be scared in that time, not used to such dissonant harmonies?
     
  4. Chaotica

    Chaotica New Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2006
    Messages:
    201
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Germany
    Last Name:
    Lebenstedt
    First Name:
    Jan-Felix
    These are again very good recordings of yours. I agree with Olaf that, in both recordings, there are really no ugly-sounding notes or chords. Everything seems right-placed (don't know whether there are slips or misreadings because I haven't played these pieces) and your touch is still very good and sensitive.

    Only a few ideas: I think you could take the nocturnes a bit freelier in some places. In the first piece e.g., there are these fermatas; you could wait a bit a longer as this is an important and surprising moment. Regarding the other piece, I found your tempo a bit too slow. Yes, there is no indication and everyone can play it how she/he wants, but I agree with you that it isn't much of an epic nocturne so it could be a bit more straight-forward. The runs are a bit unsure to my ears, too.

    That's only the obligatory minor "niggling", of course. :wink: Besides that, everything's fine.
     
  5. pianolady

    pianolady Monica Hart, Administrator Staff Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2006
    Messages:
    8,716
    Likes Received:
    1
    Last Name:
    Hart
    First Name:
    Monica
    Thank you John, Olaf and Jan-Felix.

    John, yes - these are geniune - recorded in my usual pajama regalia. :)

    Jan - I could hold out the fermatas longer. I guess I'm just not overly dramatic, in my playing, anyway. But thanks for the suggestion.

    Olaf, I’m so glad you noticed the bass notes. I consciously made them stronger. With just these pieces, I now have changed the way I play the low notes. I used to think I was too loud on the left hand, and tried hard to make it softer than my right hand. But then I realized that I like strong bass notes –( I always turn the bass up in my car) so why can’t I hear them in my own playing, too? I’m so appreciative when you and the others say things like this and I know you won’t hold back when I’m doing things wrong too.

    Now you’re scaring me. Hope you don’t think I’m another Setrak. ( Of course, not, silly, she says as she knocks on her head) My playing is clearly amateur, as anyone can tell, and these two pieces were relatively easy and also short.

    It is a most unusual ending to a nocturne. Talk about making the ‘nocturne style’ his own! It is a little scary, which is why I liked the major chord ending. Or maybe he found the beautiful piece actually did put people to sleep so he added the end to wake everybody up.

    Thanks again.
     
  6. MindenBlues

    MindenBlues New Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2006
    Messages:
    692
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Germany
    Home Page:
    Last Name:
    Schmidt
    First Name:
    Olaf
    Your bass voicing shows me what I need to change myself. As I played lately a longer g minor piece by Chopin (you know which piece I mean) before a professional, there was a long gap afterwards and she asked me whether I like to know what she disliked the most in my playing. I thought about the numerous mistakes and wrong notes and was very surprised - she said, the bass voice was much too weak throughout the piece, regardless whether soft or loud passages. You don't suffer from this problem -be glad! Lately, I now play with completely open lid to let out the complete bass, at least what is possible with that short grand I have - in order to listen more to the left hand part.

    If you would post all Chopin's ballades and scherzi and sonatas within some days distance and without any slips I probably would be sceptic...
    Easy pieces? With 5 sharps? Amateur? Let's come to a compromise: A very advanced amateur, who enjoys people throughout the world through profound postings at PianoSociety!
     
  7. pianolady

    pianolady Monica Hart, Administrator Staff Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2006
    Messages:
    8,716
    Likes Received:
    1
    Last Name:
    Hart
    First Name:
    Monica
    Oh, Olaf. You're so nice. :)

    I know exactly what you mean about those low notes. Funny how your teacher said the same thing. Isn't it nice that we can share these ideas?
     
  8. techneut

    techneut Active Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2006
    Messages:
    9,930
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Last Name:
    Breemer
    First Name:
    Chris
    Beautifully played, both pieces. I think that C minor Nocturne is definitely by Chopin, I can't think of any other composer who could have written it. But I would have though it is a very early work as well.
    The only things I can niggle about are in the 27.2, the strange unisono arpeggio in the penultimate bar, and the D natural in the last chord, which accoring to Paderewski should be D flat - the piece ending in minor as it seems to have been intended, I think.

    But again very strong preformances from you. I'l put them up the site. Go for a complete Nocturne cycle now... you can do it.
     
  9. techneut

    techneut Active Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2006
    Messages:
    9,930
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Last Name:
    Breemer
    First Name:
    Chris
    They are up the site !
     
  10. robert

    robert New Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2006
    Messages:
    1,842
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Sweden
    Home Page:
    Last Name:
    Stahlbrand
    First Name:
    Robert
    I do not know this for 100% certain but if I remember this correct, the C minor Nocturne was produced from an unfinished sketch provided by Paris Conservatory Library and published the first time in 1937. I think it was Paderewski who gave it the composition year 1837 which is the most common an accepted year of composition while it for sure sounds like a much more immature work like the C-sharp minor which was composed 1830. Or even more immature.

    Great playing of both Nocturnes and if I should give an advice, really suck out the sweets out of the high octave notes in the C minor that repeats in variated form a couple of times. Otherwise, very good Monica.
     
  11. pianolady

    pianolady Monica Hart, Administrator Staff Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2006
    Messages:
    8,716
    Likes Received:
    1
    Last Name:
    Hart
    First Name:
    Monica
    Thank you very much Chris and Robert.

    Chris, did I play that unisono arpeggio wrong? (do you mean the one in the third to last measure?) I guess I play it kind of fast, but I think I got all the notes. Maybe not? And that d-natural - I've never heard it as a d-flat (at least i don't think so). Someday I guess I'll have to surf around the internet more and look for other versions of this piece.

    A complete nocturne cycle? Thanks for the vote of confidence, but I can't. I've run out of nocturnes I can actually play. :lol:

    Robert, I'm not sure I know how to suck out the sweets out of the high octave notes, but this makes me laugh. I'm guessing you mean for me to come down louder or longer or stronger or bigger etc...
    So if the c-minor was published first in 1837, then Chopin was 27 years old. And you're right that doesn't mean that's when he wrote it. Thanks for the info.
     
  12. techneut

    techneut Active Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2006
    Messages:
    9,930
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Last Name:
    Breemer
    First Name:
    Chris
    I'd have to listen again. It sounded funny to me - overly rapid, uneven and blurred. Not a big deal though.

    I can't remember how I ever heard it. But I assume the Padereski score should be correct in having D flat. I think it would be strange that Chopin would turn to major key again in the last note, after tacking such a desperate minor key code on to this optimistic major Nocturne. Also I can't remember any other occasion where he uses a major note for last.

    Bollocks... Get practising !

    You probably played them too sweetly :lol:
     
  13. pianolady

    pianolady Monica Hart, Administrator Staff Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2006
    Messages:
    8,716
    Likes Received:
    1
    Last Name:
    Hart
    First Name:
    Monica
    Oh, I think I misunderstood you. You're talking about the 'very' last chord I think, the one that I play as a d-sharp. I thought you meant a d-natural a couple chords back from there. I remember you talking about this major/minor end before. Yes, the minor is much more common - I'm just playing what's in my book. I'll be pretty mad if it's a case of a simple 'typo'. I have Schirmer book which I know isn't most reliable but they had to get this d-sharp from somewhere. (I hope)
     
  14. John Robson

    John Robson New Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2007
    Messages:
    829
    Likes Received:
    0
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Miami, Florida, USA
    Last Name:
    Robson
    First Name:
    John
    Nocturnes

    Another sensitive recording of Chopin by you! I've never studied either piece, but they both were beautifully played. I noticed how you nicely brought out the bass notes. That adds a lot to your playing. I followed along with my score of the first one, and I found nothing wrong. Your interpretation was right on. I've never heard the second one before, but it sounds like early Chopin to me also. Thanks for the pleasant music.
     
  15. pianolady

    pianolady Monica Hart, Administrator Staff Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2006
    Messages:
    8,716
    Likes Received:
    1
    Last Name:
    Hart
    First Name:
    Monica
    Thank you, John.
     
  16. MindenBlues

    MindenBlues New Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2006
    Messages:
    692
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Germany
    Home Page:
    Last Name:
    Schmidt
    First Name:
    Olaf
    Rats.. did I say D flat ? I meant D natural of course. Sloppy......
     
  17. robert

    robert New Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2006
    Messages:
    1,842
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Sweden
    Home Page:
    Last Name:
    Stahlbrand
    First Name:
    Robert
    It was meant to make you laugh and you got it quite right ;). Barenboim said that Cortot was looking for the opium in music and this is the opium in this nocturne.
     
  18. pianolady

    pianolady Monica Hart, Administrator Staff Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2006
    Messages:
    8,716
    Likes Received:
    1
    Last Name:
    Hart
    First Name:
    Monica
    Wow, I never heard it put like that, before.



    Don't worry Olaf. I'm more confused than ever, anyway. :)
     
  19. MindenBlues

    MindenBlues New Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2006
    Messages:
    692
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Germany
    Home Page:
    Last Name:
    Schmidt
    First Name:
    Olaf
    Something strange happened with my statement - I did not wrote this, instead something else. This sounds like a statement by Chris :roll:

    What I wrote but was unfortunately deleted was: my Edition Peters score says d sharp, but the original french edition says d natural. Furthermore, that I am glad that you choosed the German alternative.
    And I added what is above quoted as a statement by Monica. Strange....
     
  20. techneut

    techneut Active Member Piano Society Artist

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2006
    Messages:
    9,930
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Last Name:
    Breemer
    First Name:
    Chris
    Yes it is. I guess I have clicked 'Edit' instead of 'Quote' again.... Would not be the first time :oops:
    Sorry about that. Sure way to mess up a thread :roll:
    [/quote]
     

Share This Page