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 Post subject: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 9:22 pm 
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Here is the rest of my sonata in d-minor I have composed in 1984, when I was thirteen years old. For a further description of my biography as a composer and the "history" of this piece see the topic of the first movement of this sonata, please.

The second movement is an "Andante con moto" and has a songform (german: Liedform) and is what you call in german "durchbrochener Satz" (sorry, I couldn´t find an English translation for that word).
The third movement is a Menuetto with a Trio as it is typical for a classical sonata.
The fourth movement is a Rondo and has the form ABA´CA´´.

I play all movements by heart, btw.

The complete sonata is conceived as a wholeness, so I recommend to listen to the movements in their order. It was meant as an exercise then to learn the sonata form in classical respective early romantic style.

To the admins: would it be possible to make a frame with the complete sonata and to make me a link also in the category "composers"? You already have this complete sonata and a twelfe-tone composition by me on this site. Other works by me will follow. (And Riley wants to play some, too. :wink: ) Thank you in advance!

Here are the video-links:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qREuNFkhitM (second mv., Andante con moto)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qlI_o3G_HBA (third mv., Menuetto - Trio - Menuetto D.C.)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FxXjtBHMt9M (fourth mv., Rondo, Allegro)

The mp3-files are exact the sound-track of the videos above:

Pfaul - Sonata in D minor - 1: Allegro (2:42)
Pfaul - Sonata in D minor - 2: Andante con moto (3:26)
Pfaul - Sonata in D minor - 3: Menuetto (1:53)
Pfaul - Sonata in D minor - 4: Rondo (1:47)

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 Post subject: Re: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 2:53 am 
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Hi Andreas,

I had a listen to your recordings. I think they are very wonderful movements to follow the first. The Andante has a wonderful "flowing" feeling to it The Minuetto reminds me of Bach, a very orderly classical piece. The B section is wonderful, in it's runs, and you play this at quite a clip, I think you truly have a good tempo for it. There are runs in this in a Haydn piece I played last year that seemed impossible for me to play crisply, but that was on a digital. The Rondo at parts reminds me of Tchaikovsky's "The Nutcracker," perhaps it was an influence? The leading tone trills that only last for three notes, those are interesting to me, in and of themselves. The ending on a solid d minor chord adds a special finality to the sonata. Now to transcribe these, I should hope that I do not misinterpret your original manuscript, though I will ask you if I have questions.

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 Post subject: Re: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 2:53 am 
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Hi Andreas,

I had a listen to your recordings. I think they are very wonderful movements to follow the first. The Andante has a wonderful "flowing" feeling to it The Minuetto reminds me of Bach, a very orderly classical piece. The B section is wonderful, in it's runs, and you play this at quite a clip, I think you truly have a good tempo for it. There are runs in this in a Haydn piece I played last year that seemed impossible for me to play crisply, but that was on a digital. The Rondo at parts reminds me of Tchaikovsky's "The Nutcracker," perhaps it was an influence? The leading tone trills that only last for three notes, those are interesting to me, in and of themselves. The ending on a solid d minor chord adds a special finality to the sonata. Now to transcribe these, I should hope that I do not misinterpret your original manuscript, though I will ask you if I have questions.

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 Post subject: Re: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2013 12:08 pm 
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The admins had some some doubt whether we should be hosting juvenile compositions by PS members. But after listening to this Sonata I think it meets all the standards, and can be enjoyed by the general public. It is a precocious output for a 13-year old, but a grown-up amateur composer would not need to be ashamed of it. There is an ugly edit at 0:46 in the 2nd mvt, with a click and sudden tempo shift.

Although I have been too busy in and around my house to involve much with PS, I'll try to make some time to put these on the site.

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 Post subject: Re: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2013 4:54 pm 
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Hi Riley,

Pianoman342 wrote:
Quote:
I had a listen to your recordings. I think they are very wonderful movements to follow the first.


Thanks for that, Riley! :D

Quote:
The Andante has a wonderful "flowing" feeling to it


I´m glad to hear that, because I have choosen a quite fast tempo, but it´s "con moto" and I like it really "con moto". :wink:

Quote:
The Minuetto reminds me of Bach, a very orderly classical piece. The B section is wonderful, in it's runs, and you play this at quite a clip, I think you truly have a good tempo for it.


Thanks, yes, it has a good flow. I had a faster version first, but then I choosed this one, because it seemed exactly right to me.

Quote:
There are runs in this in a Haydn piece I played last year that seemed impossible for me to play crisply, but that was on a digital.


Well, you really can´t play runs and such things very well on a digital, at least I can not. I´m not able to play on a digital piano properly, because I can´t get a feeling for the music. And if I can´t get a feeling for the music, I can´t play, that´s very simple. So for me it´s simply impossible to play on digital (especially classical or let´s say "demanding" pieces in general).

Quote:
The Rondo at parts reminds me of Tchaikovsky's "The Nutcracker," perhaps it was an influence?


That´s interesting, but I have no idea. What place exactly do you mean?

Quote:
The leading tone trills that only last for three notes, those are interesting to me, in and of themselves.


Yes, for me these are small sighing motifs. The last movement (Rondo) is as lyrical as the first, so one really could say it´s a "lyrical sonata". I have played it today to my colleague, Michael Schönfelder (I have posted some recordings for clarinet and piano with him here on this site, f.ex. Poulencs sonata for clarinet and piano), and he said to me, my sonata reminds very much of Schubert. I think, he is not wrong with that. I personally feel a big affinity to this composer.

Quote:
Now to transcribe these, I should hope that I do not misinterpret your original manuscript, though I will ask you if I have questions.


That´s very kind of you. Thank you! I will practise on the new pieces by yourself, you have sent to me recently! :)

Hi Chris,

Techneut wrote:
Quote:
The admins had some some doubt whether we should be hosting juvenile compositions by PS members. But after listening to this Sonata I think it meets all the standards, and can be enjoyed by the general public. It is a precocious output for a 13-year old, but a grown-up amateur composer would not need to be ashamed of it.


Thanks for that, Chris. I also think, this sonata fulfills all standards of the sonata form and from this, it´s absolutely solid and can be offered to a general public. If this wouldn´t be the case, I would not have played them in a public concert then in 1987.

Quote:
There is an ugly edit at 0:46 in the 2nd mvt, with a click and sudden tempo shift.


I have noticed that while listening, but I swear, there are no edits in all four movements except reverb and a few Equalizer with a small boost of the higher frequencies. They all are played by heart and without any cuts! :!: This only can be something like a "digital artefact", which sometimes happens with my soundcard, when I record with 96 Khz and 32 bit float or higher. (Usually I record with 192 Khz/32bit.)These all are recorded with 96 Khz/32bit. I will see, if I can do something to delete this "ugly edit", which is no one, but I fear, it´s not possible to get that digital artefact out.

Quote:
Although I have been too busy in and around my house to involve much with PS, I'll try to make some time to put these on the site.


Thank you. I appreciate that.

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 Post subject: Re: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2013 6:34 pm 
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musicusblau wrote:
I have noticed that while listening, but I swear, there are no edits in all four movements except reverb and a few Equalizer with a small boost of the higher frequencies. They all are played by heart and without any cuts! :!:

I'm sure it's no edit but it sounds like one. I could swear the tempo is higher after the click.

musicusblau wrote:
This only can be something like a "digital artefact", which sometimes happens with my soundcard, when I record with 96 Khz and 32 bit float or higher. (Usually I record with 192 Khz/32bit.)These all are recorded with 96 Khz/32bit. I will see, if I can do something to delete this "ugly edit", which is no one, but I fear, it´s not possible to get that digital artefact out.

Ha yes, digital artefacts, I've heard about those :wink: Of course a PC has a life of its own and can suddenly decide to run some hefty task (backup, windows update, whatever it deems necessary) in the background while you are recording. I would not trust my recording process to a PC. You'd be safer off using your Zoom with the Neumanns plugged in.

Before I start processing these, could you please observe the naming and tagging rules (no spaces in file names, proper ID3 tags) ? Just about everybody else does so by now. Or else they should :!:

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 Post subject: Re: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 11:58 am 
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Techneut wrote:
Quote:
I'm sure it's no edit but it sounds like one. I could swear the tempo is higher after the click.


There come two aspects together. One is, that I really increase the tempo a bit at this place in my interpretation, the other is that there was an interuption caused by the computer from a reason, I don´t know. But I have seen this interruption clearly in Wavelab. So, I have deleted the "click-noise" by adding the two wave-ends into a fitting form. But the increase of tempo I could not reduce, because it´s in my interpretation (it´s a bit too much, I agree, but I think, it´s no reason to re-record).

Quote:
I would not trust my recording process to a PC. You'd be safer off using your Zoom with the Neumanns plugged in.


Principally you are right, the only thing is, that the sound-quality with the soundcard is a bit better.

Quote:
Before I start processing these, could you please observe the naming and tagging rules (no spaces in file names, proper ID3 tags) ? Just about everybody else does so by now. Or else they should :!:


Oh, yes, sorry, somehow I thought the ID-tags are automatically right, if you onetimes have done them correctly (like Album and so on), but I have seen now, that it´s necessary to fill them in everytime in each new file. (Phew, quite a lot of work, but it´s o.k.) :D

BTW, excuse me, if there sometimes some words are written in big letters. I have that stupid german correction of orthography in my browser (Internet Explorer) and don´t know how to Switch it off. It´s really annoying, because I always have to edit my texts I write here, because the English words are "corrected" in a wrong way. Do you know how by hazard to Switch off this correction program?

Here are the corrected files. It´s the complete Sonata.
Pfaul - Sonata in D minor - 1: Allegro (2:42)
Pfaul - Sonata in D minor - 2: Andante con moto (3:26)
Pfaul - Sonata in D minor - 3: Menuetto (1:53)
Pfaul - Sonata in D minor - 4: Rondo (1:47)

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 Post subject: Re: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 12:15 pm 
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musicusblau wrote:
(Phew, quite a lot of work, but it´s o.k.) :D

Yes it's work, which is why we are not going to do it for everybody anymore :!:

musicusblau wrote:
BTW, excuse me, if there sometimes some words are written in big letters. I have that stupid german correction of orthography in my browser (Internet Explorer) and don´t know how to Switch it off. It´s really annoying, because I always have to edit my texts I write here, because the English words are "corrected" in a wrong way. Do you know how by hazard to Switch off this correction program?

I don't use IE so I don't know. I find the spelling checker in Chrome very useful (but I have my locale set to English, that helps :wink: ).
Have you Googled on "internet explorer disable spell check" ? This here looks useful:
http://www.askvg.com/how-to-disable-bui ... r-10-ie10/

musicusblau wrote:
Here are the corrected files. It´s the complete Sonata.
pfaul-sonata-d-minor-allegro-pfaul.mp3
pfaul-sonata-d-minor-Andante-con-moto-pfaul.mp3
pfaul-sonata-d-minor-menuetto-pfaul.mp3
pfaul-sonata-d-minor-rondo-pfaul.mp

Sorry but this is still not according to the rules. It should be

pfaul-sonatadminor-1-pfaul.mp3
pfaul-sonatadminor-2-pfaul.mp3
pfaul-sonatadminor-3-pfaul.mp3
pfaul-sonatadminor-4-pfaul.mp3

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 Post subject: Re: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 12:40 pm 
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Techneut wrote:
Quote:
Yes it's work, which is why we are not going to do it for everybody anymore :!:

I understand that absolutely. Below are the again corrected files.
Pfaul - Sonata in D minor - 1: Allegro (2:42)
Pfaul - Sonata in D minor - 2: Andante con moto (3:26)
Pfaul - Sonata in D minor - 3: Menuetto (1:53)
Pfaul - Sonata in D minor - 4: Rondo (1:47)

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 Post subject: Re: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 3:11 pm 
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Now they better be good ;-)

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 Post subject: Re: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 5:47 pm 
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Techneut wrote:
Quote:
Now they better be good ;-)


Hm, I don´t understand this sentence too well. Is this idiomatic respective colloquial English for "Now they better should be good" (otherwise I will crash your head or so :lol: ) or does it mean "They are better than good (more than good) now"?
BTW, it´s the first time - since the new rules for tags exist - that I post a work with more than one movement, so I didn´t know, that they had to be numbered like this, sorry for that.

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 Post subject: Re: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 6:08 pm 
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It's creative English :-)
Yes they should better be ok now or I'll have to whack you round the head with a wet tea towel ;-)

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 Post subject: Re: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 7:14 pm 
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Andreas, did you read all of the post we made about Naming and Tagging ? It says there :

Quote:
In ID3 tags,

Name

This is what is shown in an MP3 player. The syntax must be:
Composer - Name of piece (NOTE: THERE MUST BE EXACTLY ONE SPACE BEFORE AND AFTER THE DASH).


So, not a comma. These details matter !

I will need to add in that place that one must use ONLY THE LAST NAME of the composer. Unless the name is not unique (e.g. Bach sons).
You did not fill in some of the other tags but that is no big deal.
For a multipart work, the custom is to add another hyphen and a sequence number. I'll need to document that too.
Of course one should use English notation, not German. So the tags should really be:

Quote:
Pfaul - Sonata in D minor - 1: Allegro
Pfaul - Sonata in D minor - 2: Andante con moto
Pfaul - Sonata in D minor - 3: Menuetto
Pfaul - Sonata in D minor - 4: Rondo


The Artist name should not be

andreas pfaul, klavier

but just

Andreas Pfaul.

The Allbum Artist tag we don't use. The Composer tag we like to be filled in, for future use. Normally only the last name but maybe in this case the full name.

Ironically, so far it's been much more work to get people to do this properly (and document it properly) than to just to fix things ourselves. Not sure if this investment will actually pay off. I'll go and update the rules soon.

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 Post subject: Re: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 12:35 pm 
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Techneut wrote:
Quote:
Andreas, did you read all of the post we made about Naming and Tagging ?


Oh dear, oh dear, I truly can feel that wet tea towel now. :shock: :lol:
I have read all, but - I have to admit - I didn´t take the time to look for some (special) words, I did not understand like "dash" or "hyphen" and much more, so I didn´t understand all. For a "null" in English like me it´s quite a lot of time, but I promise to better myself. :)

Quote:
The Composer tag we like to be filled in, for future use. Normally only the last name but maybe in this case the full name.


Unfortunately I have not found a composer tag in the windows music library. I show you a screenshot of what I have there below. All the other fields, which are shown under "features" (when you open the menu of the file with a right click), I can not edit! :!:

Thank you for your instructions and also for the link how to switch off the spelling correction! I had success with it! :D



I hope the files are o.k. now, so I have not suffer a second beat with the tea towel! :wink:

Pfaul - Sonata in D minor - 1: Allegro (2:42)
Pfaul - Sonata in D minor - 2: Andante con moto (3:26)
Pfaul - Sonata in D minor - 3: Menuetto (1:53)
Pfaul - Sonata in D minor - 4: Rondo (1:47)

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 Post subject: Re: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 7:33 pm 
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musicusblau wrote:
Unfortunately I have not found a composer tag in the windows music library. I show you a screenshot of what I have there below. All the other fields, which are shown under "features" (when you open the menu of the file with a right click), I can not edit! :!:

Never mind the Composer tag, we do not use it (yet).

musicusblau wrote:
I hope the files are o.k. now, so I have not suffer a second beat with the tea towel! :wink:

Nope, we are done with the towel. I have a bag of cement ready for the next round. :P
But no need to worry, they are fine now. Practice makes perfect... I always knew you could do it :D
I'm uploading them now, will update the site later (had a bit too much wine to do that right now).

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 Post subject: Re: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 10:08 am 
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Techneut wrote:
Quote:
Never mind the Composer tag, we do not use it (yet).


I think, if you will introduce the composer tag in future all people, who use the windows 7 music library will have a problem, because they can´t edit it. :twisted:

Quote:
Nope, we are done with the towel. I have a bag of cement ready for the next round. :P


Well, may be that´s a bit better than tar and plumes and it´s more adequate to modern civilisation (compared with the good old Wild West). :lol:

Quote:
But no need to worry, they are fine now. Practice makes perfect... I always knew you could do it :D


Thanks for the lessons (and the work you had with it).

Quote:
(had a bit too much wine to do that right now).


There is nothing like a good glass of Lambrusco (and a glass of 43 liqeur, which I have bought today for my guests from Bergisch-Gladbach we have met in Workum). :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 8:27 pm 
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Ok, at last this sonata is on the site.

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 Post subject: Re: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 4:31 pm 
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Techneut wrote:
Quote:
Ok, at last this sonata is on the site.

Thank you very much, Chris! :D Would it be possible to create a link with my name to my two pieces (twelfe tone etude, sonata d-minor) from the composers category like you did for Franz? I would be very glad about that.

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 Post subject: Re: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 7:22 pm 
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musicusblau wrote:
Thank you very much, Chris! :D Would it be possible to create a link with my name to my two pieces (twelfe tone etude, sonata d-minor) from the composers category like you did for Franz? I would be very glad about that.

Not having been very active recently, I have a bit of trouble remembering how this all hangs together on the site. Composing performers are a complication... I still need to move your twelve-tone etude from _Various to a different page (Pfaul - Miscellaneous ? ) but apart from that I don't see what more there is to do.

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 Post subject: Re: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 3:50 am 
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Chris,

I think Andreas means that he would like to have a page like Mr. Streuff on the site (next to all the other big composers). Andreas, if I am wrong, please correct me.

Andreas,

There was a topic posted about this in the Announcements forum:

http://pianosociety.com/new/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=4974

Though I personally see your pieces much more tasteful in the "classical sense" than For ex. Carter Pann or Till Meyn, but I would point out that others of great composing skills are all together in the pianist/composer tab (with the exception of me :wink: ), and that in some ways we are "featured," in that we are at the top of the directory, just above Albeniz :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 7:14 am 
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pianoman342 wrote:
I think Andreas means that he would like to have a page like Mr. Streuff on the site (next to all the other big composers). Andreas, if I am wrong, please correct me.

Mr. Streuff doesn't have a page next to the other big composers. He is in the separate "Member composers" page, as are Andreas and yourself. Is this ideal ? I don't know. Again the question for me is, what makes someone a composer ? Many people try their hand at composing at some stage. Am I a carpenter just because I do some construction work now and then ? And furthermore, what makes one a "member" ? There's a guy in that list who is definitely not a member (Schutz) and another who is the father of a member (Froschhammer). This topic tends to give me a headache just like trying to categorize transcriptions. We can never do it right. I dearly wish we had a site WITHOUT pages, just recordings listed, with a good search facility and a real good embedded player. It would not be better per se, but far less hassle and maintenance.

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 Post subject: Re: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 11:05 am 
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Hi Chris and Riley,
I didn´t notice that difference of non member composers and member composers on the main page. I always thought, Franz had a link on the composers page like Bach, Beethoven etc. and I think, it was like this, but has been changed after your decision to distinguish between member composers and non member composers. Of course, I don´t want be an exception and I don´t acclaim a link in the non member composers section.

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 Post subject: Re: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Sat Jun 15, 2013 2:27 pm 
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Location: Lyon, France
Hello Andreas,
I am coming quite late after the battle, but this morning I had the chance to listen your whole sonata during my breakfast. Hence it was a very good start for this day ! This music is very fresh, and well written, especially for a teenager. Of course, we can hear similarities with Scarlatti, Haydn, Mozart and maybe some early Beethoven; apparently you were quite fond of XVIIIth century music at this time. I have also listened your 12-tone study, which displays a much more modern inspiration. Whatever the style, you have a really nice talent as a composer. I guess you should lack time to compose, having a job and trying to remain a good pianist. This is also my case, and I am just waiting for my retirement to develop this ability. Is it the same for you ? Or do you still compose from time to time ? In this case, you should post us more music from yourself. What about improvisation ? A good pianist/composer can only be a good improviser, can't he ?
Regards,

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 Post subject: Re: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 8:41 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jan 20, 2008 5:45 pm
Posts: 2815
Location: Germany
Dear Francois,
thank you for taking time to listen to my little pieces and to comment. :D
Yes, mainly it´s a problem of time, but somehow I don´t feel inspirated to compose since many years. I love to improvise and in former times I did it much more than nowadays. But nearly all my compositions come from improvisation. So I agree, that a good composer should also be a good improvisator.
Nice to hear you also would like to compose. I would like to encourage you. I personally don´t know, if I will do it again. May be, if I´m retired, who knows...
Thank you for your encouraging words! :)

All the best
Andreas

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 Post subject: Re: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Wed Jun 19, 2013 3:31 am 
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Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2008 9:48 pm
Posts: 2001
Location: U.S.A.
Hi Andreas,

I recall when you posted only two movements, so it's nice to hear the complete sonata now. I liked it very much. I believe it's remarkable that you were able to compose this at age 13! And your playing of the work is equally outstanding.

David

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 Post subject: Re: Andreas Pfaul, Sonata d-minor, 2.-4. movement
PostPosted: Wed Jun 19, 2013 10:21 pm 
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Location: Germany
Rachfan wrote:

Quote:
I recall when you posted only two movements, so it's nice to hear the complete sonata now. I liked it very much. I believe it's remarkable that you were able to compose this at age 13! And your playing of the work is equally outstanding.


Thank you very much, David, for listening and your encouraging words! It means a lot to me. :D
(Tomorrow I will listen to your new submission, looking forward to it! :) )

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