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 Post subject: Re: Rare music of Eduardo Dutra: Preludio, Op. 32 in F#m
PostPosted: Mon Oct 22, 2012 2:09 pm 
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Now, tell us, Luis: do you not think this "Mariangela" is someone who does not exist, a "malandro"? I am sure that who wrote all that is not Brazilian, because that is just not the way a Brazilian would write.

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 Post subject: Re: Rare music of Eduardo Dutra: Preludio, Op. 32 in F#m
PostPosted: Mon Oct 22, 2012 5:40 pm 
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Sorry, where is this "Mariângela"?

I only saw Mônica Vasconselos' article on BBC website.

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 Post subject: Re: Rare music of Eduardo Dutra: Preludio, Op. 32 in F#m
PostPosted: Mon Oct 22, 2012 7:18 pm 
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Read these two posts, Luis: the earlier (the first) one is a bit different from the later (second) one. Notice the names: HENRY Oswald, for example.
Quote:
Dr. Eduardo D'Utra e Silva, inherited the Laboratory F. Dutra, Fabrizio your father and also the love of letters and arts. Eduardo's father Dick, a pediatrician, philosopher, composer, musician, very cultivated, an expert in wrestling, polyglot, including full fluency in Greek, he studied philosophy devoting himself especially the neo-scholastic. Famous conductor and composer, and very successful entrepreneur also taught to a select group of students, one of the famous students of Eduardo Dutra e Silva, Jack Klein was professor Arnaldo Cohen.
In music he joined the neo-romanticism. He studied music theory with renowned masters, violin with Joaquim Boisson; perfected in piano with Henry Oswald, Barroso Neto and Charley Lachmund.
Eduardo Dutra was a classical composer of great prestige and over the years leading conductors and soloists have performed several of his works, among them Francisco Braga, Henrique Spedini, Ernesto Ronchini Arthur Bosmans, Martinez Degree and recently Arnaldo Cohen recently presented one of his works on his CD released in 2005.
Among the soloists, Mario Neves, Mario de Azevedo, Arnaldo Rebello, Josette Dyla, Isaac Feldman, Peri Machado and others. His works are performed, Concerto in F sharp minor, "ballet - Pantomime" entitled "The Princess of Medinet - el Fayum," five "Preludes", "Orientales" (suite of seven dances of oriental character), "Idyll" Etc. For piano, "Sonata in C minor, twelve" Preludes "and six" Miniatures "(children's suite), five" studies "," Five "Mazurkas" and three "Viennese Waltz" concert, "Three Berceuse" "Concerto No. 2" Piano "Concerto No. 1" for orchestra. Eduardo studied philosophy and theology, many hours a day with equal dedication to music.
As a pediatrician served only children of friends and relatives.
The evenings were frequented by famous artists, musicians, singers and well Cyl Dick and grew in an environment focused on the arts and philosophy.
It is worth noting that all you had to practice wrestling watching Grandpa and his followers and coach
This is part of the book is a biography of Dick Farney.
Mariangela- I am the heir of both, put me to provide further information, thank you and to emphasize that we are thrilled with the comments about the work of Eduardo Dutra.

Quote:
Eduardo Dutra, was a composer and scholar of great reputation over the years outstanding conductors and soloists performed several of his works, among them Francisco Braga (was artistic director and conductor of the Orchestra Symphonic Concert Society), Henry Spedini (conductor holder Symphony Orchestra of Theatro Municipal do Rio de Janeiro), by Symphony Orchestra of Rio de Janeiro under the baton of conductor and professor Ernesto Ronchini, conductor Arthur Bosmans, Martinez Degree and recently Arnaldo Cohen recently presented one of his works in his Cd edited in 2005.
Among the soloists, Mario Neves, Mario de Azevedo, Arnaldo Rebello, Dyla Josetti, Isaac Feldman, Peri Machado and others. His works are performed more; Concerto in F sharp minor; "Balet - pantomime" entitled "The Princess of Medinet - el Fayum," five "Preludes", "Orientales" (suite of seven dances of oriental character), "Idyll" Etc. For Piano, "Sonata in C minor; twelve" Preludes "and six" Miniatures "(suite child); five" Studies ";" Five "Mazurkas" and three "Viennese Waltzes"; concert, "Three Berceuses" "Concerto No. 2" for piano and "Concerto No. 1" for orquestra.Arthur Rubinstein presented several pieces and presented Anatoli Kitain Hall Carnigie presented in the composition of Eduardo "Prelude in F Minor." The Orquetra Sinfonica Brasileira presented hundreds of works by Eduardo of which he himself excelled "Prelude for String" and "Concerto for piano and orchestra.
Eduardo studied philosophy, theology and many hours per day with equal dedication to the music, to lecture to a select group of students, with the sole purpose of perfecting them, competent administrator transforms the lab he inherited from his father, one of the most important its segment, and its production successes in various areas combined produce beautiful book.
Eduardo, marries a young socialite Iracema, pianist, artist plastica (traditional society of Alagoas and Rio), had two sons Dick Farney (Farnesio Dutra e Silva) famous conductor, arranger, singer, pianist, actor and presenter and Cyll Farney (Cylleno Dutra e Silva) known film and television actor, entrepreneur, musician.
Eduardo Dutra and devoted himself Suiva follow very diligently to encourage the children in their artistic activities and was the biggest fan of the work they performed, died in 1953 of myocardial infarction fulminat.
I am heiress to Dick Farney and I am available for more information on Dick Farney, Cyll Farney children and the Dutra Dr.Eduardo own Eduardo Dutra.


I asked a conductor from Sao Paulo to look into Eduardo Dutra. The good thing is that he knows people who knew Dick Farney. Let us hope.

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 Post subject: Re: Rare music of Eduardo Dutra: Preludio, Op. 32 in F#m
PostPosted: Mon Oct 22, 2012 7:38 pm 
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Is Dutra so important a composer that we should go this length ? Did he actually compose anything else besides this work (which sounds suspiciously like a piece by some Russian composer) ? The opus number suggests so but I'm starting to feel like this whole Dutra thing is a scam.
No composer can be so obscure that only his Op.32 is known to the world. Either the rest doesn't exist or it is too bad to be remembered.

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 Post subject: Re: Rare music of Eduardo Dutra: Preludio, Op. 32 in F#m
PostPosted: Mon Oct 22, 2012 8:11 pm 
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The point is another, Chris, and by this time has little to do with the merits or demerits of this composer. I do not like scammers and I would like to see this one exposed. Besides all that, I am not taking too much trouble about it, but since the condictor was here and I was giving him assistance... Why not ask?

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 Post subject: Re: Rare music of Eduardo Dutra: Preludio, Op. 32 in F#m
PostPosted: Mon Oct 22, 2012 8:54 pm 
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So you think this Mariângela could be cheating us? Is she Brazilian?
You're right, it's difficult to imagine a Brazilian writing HENRY Oswald. Henrique Oswald is such an important composer, and well known, and name translations is usually not done any more (in the past, almost one century ago, Brazilian scholars would write Luís de Beethoven, João Sebastião Bach, José Haydn...). How old is Mariângela?

I had already asked some people in my college who work with Brazilian music. They don't know Eduardo Dutra.
The other problem is that Dutra is a common last name, so there are LOTS OF Eduard Dutras.

But there are things that are in common in these two texts. Did Mariângela write both of them?

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 Post subject: Re: Rare music of Eduardo Dutra: Preludio, Op. 32 in F#m
PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2012 9:49 am 
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João Sebastião Bach? :shock: How dare you? :x João Sebastião RIBEIRO, if you please! :D

As for the other questions, no one knows the answers.

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Richard Willmer
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 Post subject: Re: Rare music of Eduardo Dutra: Preludio, Op. 32 in F#m
PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 1:23 am 
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Until now I've been silent on the Eduardo Dutra mystery. But now I'll add my two cents worth or conjecture. First, the handwritten inscription on the front cover of the "Preludio", Op. 32 to Neusa Franca signed by Dutra proves, for me at least, that he was a real person. I believe that Dutra's career was his laboratory business but that he also had an intense interest in composing. It's even possible he was able to have some of his music heard in recitals and concerts, although we've seen no printed programs or newspaper clippings that would verify that as fact. I do not doubt that he might have known some important and influential composers, musicians, artists and authors, and might have hosted them at soirees in his home from time to time. We know that he reprinted his own music, possibly because it was his preference, or that his music was not accepted and published as commercial sheet music. There is no doubt that Farnesio, his son, became Dick Farney, a well-known pianist and "crooner" who can be seen performing in several videos at YouTube. I recall in Rubinstein's autobiography My Young Years that he was a friend of Villa Lobos and his family, but I don't remember any reference to Eduardo Dutra.

When Dutra died, probably his wife, Iracema da Silva, might have stored his scores at their home. Where they were private and not published scores, perhaps libraries and archives would not accept them into their collections. When Iracema died, most likely Farnesio had the responsibility and burden of closing the Dutra estate. If there was a will, he probably distributed any bequests accordingly. As for the scores, where "Dick Farney" was into popular music, maybe he didn't share his father's enthusiasm for classical music, did not see value in them from his perspective, so disposed of those scores or at best put them in an attic. That would explain why they no longer seem to be extant.

As for Mariangela, she has mentioned numerous titles of Dutra's piano pieces especially that pique our curiosity, but she has never said where the sheet music may be found in this day and age. I speculate the reason is that she simply doesn't know so cannot be helpful in that regard.

That's my theory.

David

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 Post subject: Re: Rare music of Eduardo Dutra: Preludio, Op. 32 in F#m
PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 8:11 am 
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Interesting theory. If true, it is a sad story, that almost nothing is left or even known about a composer of some merit. You should try get in touch with Dick Farney's heirs, maybe they can clear out their attic.

But people believe what they want to be believe. Your story contains all these words: possible, no doubt, might, might, possibly, no doubt, probably, most likely, maybe, speculate. It's largely conjecture, in other words.

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 Post subject: Re: Rare music of Eduardo Dutra: Preludio, Op. 32 in F#m
PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 4:40 pm 
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But David: there was a younger brother, Cilenio (Cyl Farney) who died in 2003.

You also seem to pass over the fact that if all these pieces have been performed in public - and a ballet of piano concerto cannot be in private, unless one is King - by orchestras that are in existence in theatres that are extant by musicians who are living (and some of those on the list are) there would be some record of it. I wrote to Neusa França on Facebook and through Dib Franciss but received no reply. Pierre Feraux, who plays this piece, knows nothing - and he is a friend of Neusa's. I also wrote to Arnaldo Cohen, with no reply either. An enquiry to the Moreira Salles Institute (to which PS member Alexandre Dias is connected) and that was ignored too. I also notice that Alexandre, who also knows Neusa, does not say anything much.

As for that "biography" of Dick, that is also a fabrication, unless that is also among the non-published works.

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 Post subject: Re: Rare music of Eduardo Dutra: Preludio, Op. 32 in F#m
PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:43 pm 
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Hi Richard,

Sorry, I neglected to mention Cilenio. But I can say now that had he taken charge of the scores (we don't know that he did), then clearly he never did anything to promote them, or if he did make such an effort, then it it came to naught. This music is not to be found in sheet music stores. My conclusion is that he was no more effective than his brother Farnesio in preserving them. It makes it all the easier to tentatively conclude that those scores probably no longer exist--i.e., they were likely placed in the rubbish. As for the Preludio, Op. 32, it appears to be one happy, isolated, lucky fluke--a piece that made its way into Jacques Klein's library and Neusa Franca's studio. But not one other score so far as we know has met a similar fortuitous fate.

As for public performances of Dutra's music, while Mariangela's statements may be true, we've not seen any hard evidence to support that claim such as printed recital or concert programs or newspaper clippings by music editors or critics. Nor has a conductor, pianist, orchestra musician, musicologist, music teacher, concert goer, friend, acquaintance, or anyone else to date stepped forward to vouch for the great music of Dutra heard in the concert and recital halls of Rio de Janiero. Instead the response to date has been "I never heard of him." If we did have such evidence, then I would be more persuaded; but it still might fail to inform us of the whereabouts of the scores today.

I don't know if Mariangela is a scam or not. She has made numerous statements in two postings and claims to "own" Eduardo Dutra, but efforts to verify many of those "facts" have met a dead end.

I would like nothing better than to be optimistic and hopeful--who would not want to play another Dutra piece as appealing as the Preludio? But to date there has been no solid evidence of an extant treasure trove of scores by Dutra. I'm not trying to be a naysayer, but simply a realist as I consider this very odd situation.

David

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 Post subject: Re: Rare music of Eduardo Dutra: Preludio, Op. 32 in F#m
PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 11:07 pm 
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Hi Chris,

Yes, I used those terms to carefully convey that my theory was conjecture and speculation. Mariangela's postings make for intriguing reading, but we've seen no supporting evidence or heard from anyone else who could vouch for the Dutra narrative. Had I not used words like "probably, possibly, might be, etc.", then I would have been making assertions without any way to prove them. I wanted above all to avoid that perception.

Yes, it's a sad affair to be sure. Probably in his lifetime Dutra should have left very clear instructions in his will as to his wishes in the matter of his music scores upon his death.

David

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Last edited by Rachfan on Sat Oct 27, 2012 11:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Rare music of Eduardo Dutra: Preludio, Op. 32 in F#m
PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 11:09 pm 
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Rachfan wrote:
Hi Chris,

Yes, I used those terms to freely convey that my theory was conjecture and speculation. Mariangela's postings make for intriguing reading, but we've seen no supporting evidence or heard from anyone else who could vouch for the Dutra narrative. Had I not used words like "probably, possibly, might be, etc.", then I would have been making assertions without any way to prove them. I wanted above all to avoid that perception.

Yes, it's a sad affair to be sure. Probably in his lifetime Dutra should have left very clear instructions in his will as to his wises in the matter of his music scores upon his death.

David


Maybe he did and that is why nothing is extant.

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He is doing his best."
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 Post subject: Re: Rare music of Eduardo Dutra: Preludio, Op. 32 in F#m
PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 11:12 pm 
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Hi Chris,

Absolutely. Had he called for the destruction of his scores for whatever reason, and if that was dutifully carried out, then it too could explain why they have disappeared.

David

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 Post subject: Re: Rare music of Eduardo Dutra: Preludio, Op. 32 in F#m
PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 9:00 am 
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I have not seen so much speculation since reading an attempted biography of Scarlatti ;-). Seems like we have discussed Dutra more than many other composers. Time to move on, IMO.

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