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PostPosted: Thu Dec 11, 2008 4:50 am 
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Joined: Mon Nov 03, 2008 7:58 pm
Posts: 42
Location: Stroudsburg, PA
Good post. I want to say thanks first though, because most of the piano forums that I've been on, people have greeted me with stupidity, such as: "OMG You played for four years and you're only working on Beethoven's Pathetique? I was playing Liszt's Hungarian Rhapsody blah blah blah"

I appreciate the maturity.

As far as the level at which you were playing, I don't necessarily agree entirely with that. My teacher performed the Ocean etude his freshman year, the Tristesse and the Revolutionary his sophomore year, some Liszt etudes for his third year, and a few Scriabin etudes his fourth, at the Peabody Conservatory of John Hopkin's University, studying under Leon Fleischer.

In his graduate work, for his masters, he played Chopin Op.10 and 28 for the first year, and a bunch of Spanish work after that (Villa Lobos, and others), and for his Doctorate, Beethoven's Fourth and Fifth Piano Concertos. He started playing piano when he was 13 years old, five years before he began playing at the university level. Five years is, I think, a long time where one can easily begin to start working on difficult pieces, even if they don't perform them up to par, simply because it will enhance your technique earlier in the stages of learning. I'm open to argument, as you have far more experience than me, but I'm a bit closer to my teacher and his philosophies than somebody I've communicated to through a web forum.

Actually, now that I think of it, if you happened to see a piano performance in the Spring of 2007 (or was it the summer...) at the Sydney Opera House, by a Dr. Robert Miller, that's my teacher. He performed a solo tour of Australia last year.

Anyway, I've been working on this etude now since around July. I do have a lot to do mentally to prepare, but my teacher insists that he wants me to perform it in April. I need to work on it with complete devotion. This isn't something that "I wanted to play". If you ask what I want to play, then the answer would be Beethoven's Tempest, Scriabin's Vers la Flamme, and Chopin's Op.10 n.4. The Tempest, I can slowly work my way through, but I haven't given it much time, Vers La Flamme, I need to put in some years of study before I'm able to play it, and the Op.10 n.4 is one of the most difficult pieces I've ever attempted, so once again, I need to mature a bit before I can begin work on that monster.

I've already performed the Tristesse (Op. 10 n.3, for whatever reason, not many people call it by that name), and a few others.

Just to give you an idea of what I've done so far, which may or may not help in understanding where I lay in terms of performance ability...

My senior recital in May -

Mozart K.488, Piano Concerto n.23 in A
JS Bach WTC1, Prelude and Fugue in D minor and D major
Beethoven - Op. 13, Sonata in C minor
Brahams Op. 79, Rhapsodies in B and G minor
Claude Debussy - Preludes La fille aux cheveux de lin, la cathedral engloutie, and voiles
Khachaturian - Toccata

Other works that I've performed as a student:
Mozart K.397 - first recital ever, 6 months into playing
Bach 2 part inventions in d minor and a minor
Chopin Prelude in B minor, Prelude in e minor, prelude in F# Major, and Etude in E Major Op.10 n.3
Beethoven - Moonlight sonata Mvts 1 and 2, Fur Elise
CPE Bach - Solfeggietto
and there's a few smaller pieces that I've done with a local jazz group for university credit...

Since I started playing, I've put anywhere from 4-10 hours per day into playing... I'm completely devoted to it, and it's all I can think about, honestly.

It's kind of elitist to say, but I need to play piano. Whether for an audience or not, I just need to play...

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Good morning, my name's AJ. I've been playing piano since January of 2004, as a sophomore in college, and I changed my major to music. It's all I love now.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 11, 2008 6:24 am 
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Joined: Wed Aug 16, 2006 1:38 am
Posts: 647
Location: Sydney, Australia
good point and good work. You are in sydney too, I am. but I would actually like to SEE you play and I would like to hear the TONE you produced. because, I dnt want give you an empty talk untill I can hear the tone. You teacher should know what weight technique is or he/she may use the "muscle " approach rather than weight approach. Just the Weight approach is SMARTER and proce a better tonality.

Working 4 hours a day is VERY GOOD. I liked it. This is the best way to maintain the"lightening" fast touch..since all fingers and joints are so loose and easily to coordinate.

ANY one does the university course, had at least Grade 7, or 8 level for their audition before to be considered or accepted as an music students unless one is exceptinally prodigy.

To reach that level(performance/concert), you need to play at least 5-10 yeras at younger age. I know Rector(russian pianist -passed away), he did not start his concert life until age of 45. But again, he is one of the kind. There is a fine line between a musician and technician. A good muscial feeling played from ones heart is more important than just able to play it up to speed.

Cheeers


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 20, 2009 4:37 pm 
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Joined: Mon Nov 03, 2008 7:58 pm
Posts: 42
Location: Stroudsburg, PA
and here's what happened.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=424ZAux_Z40

(Apologies for bad sound quality - can't afford a camcorder)

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Good morning, my name's AJ. I've been playing piano since January of 2004, as a sophomore in college, and I changed my major to music. It's all I love now.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 21, 2009 4:11 pm 
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Joined: Fri Sep 07, 2007 1:04 pm
Posts: 725
Location: Louisiana, USA
techneut wrote:
Hah... playing the Revolutionary on piano is peanuts.
Watch this young whippersnapper playing it on organ, his feet doing the LH part :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pQxyQktNFwc


Oh, that is just sick!

and mean too, Chris :P I mean not at all discouraging to someone trying to learn this piece! :lol:

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the one, the only ... Nathan Coleman
"You see, my piano is for me what his ship is to a sailor; more indeed: it is my very self, my mother tongue, my life." - Franz Liszt


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 12:41 am 
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Joined: Wed Aug 16, 2006 1:38 am
Posts: 647
Location: Sydney, Australia
perhaps, you guys wants to see this master doing a disco on revolutionary studies...

http://www.8notes.com/show_video.asp?video_id=297902

Enjoy


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 2:39 pm 
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Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2007 7:06 am
Posts: 65
Location: Israel/USA
mixah wrote:
OK, new question, same piece. (including pictures rather than just measures numbers alone)

I'm touching a few things up before I start taking lessons again (which are starting in January with the same teacher)

(A)
after the first reiteration of the main theme (around measure 27 or 28) the measure begins with a Bb minor chord, and the left hand moves to Db and has a small chromatic progression down before the G# chord in the next measure.

Now, fingering. My score (the Mikuli edition) tells me 123 4123 4123 4123 for each of the segments of 16th notes. I find that Db, C, Cb, Bb is very awkward fingering for this. Is there a reason for this fingering, other than it's what Mikuli decided to write? Are there better fingerings? I've been using 212 3123 4123 4234

The problem with this is that when I play it up to speed, I lose track of where I am, whereas I don't with the original fingering. with the original fingering, however, the first Bb and a the A natural with the third sound like crap.
Image


(B)
Next is the transition into the measure before the segment that begins in F minor.
My score tells me to go from 1 on the C, 4 on the B, and then 3 again on the C... there HAS to be a better fingering for this... Just has to be...

Image


Hi, this is my first post here (I think...). You might like to check me out on Piano Society as a pianist and a composer.

Fingering Q A: Yes, your fingering is better than Mikuli's. Let me suggest another little change on your fingering. Take the last 2 notes of the measure (a & g#) with 1 & 2.

Fingering Q B: Yes, there is a better fingering. After c (last in the bar) with the thumb, take 3 on b (first in the next bar), 1 on c, 2 on db, 1 on c.

Hope this helps.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
One last available slot in my Oct 25-31 piano camp for adults in Utica, NY.
All piano playing levels accepted.
http://ramisrhapsody.tripod.com/

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Best wishes,
Rami
http://pianofingering.tripod.com/
http://ramisrhapsody.tripod.com/
http://www.youtube.com/user/barniv
http://www.listen.to/rami


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 6:24 pm 
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Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2007 7:06 am
Posts: 65
Location: Israel/USA
Rami Bar-Niv wrote:
mixah wrote:
(A)
after the first reiteration of the main theme (around measure 27 or 28) the measure begins with a Bb minor chord, and the left hand moves to Db and has a small chromatic progression down before the G# chord in the next measure.

Now, fingering. My score (the Mikuli edition) tells me 123 4123 4123 4123 for each of the segments of 16th notes. I find that Db, C, Cb, Bb is very awkward fingering for this. Is there a reason for this fingering, other than it's what Mikuli decided to write? Are there better fingerings? I've been using 212 3123 4123 4234

The problem with this is that when I play it up to speed, I lose track of where I am, whereas I don't with the original fingering. with the original fingering, however, the first Bb and a the A natural with the third sound like crap.
Image



Fingering Q A: Yes, your fingering is better than Mikuli's. Let me suggest another little change on your fingering. Take the last 2 notes of the measure (a & g#) with 1 & 2.


Re fingering Q A: One more thing, actually a better suggestion than my previous one for the last 3 notes is 2, 3, 1, which is actually also written in your Mikuli music.

===============================================
One last available slot in my Oct 25-31 piano camp for adults in Utica, NY.
All piano playing levels accepted.

_________________
Best wishes,
Rami
http://pianofingering.tripod.com/
http://ramisrhapsody.tripod.com/
http://www.youtube.com/user/barniv
http://www.listen.to/rami


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 11:20 pm 
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Joined: Wed Aug 16, 2006 1:38 am
Posts: 647
Location: Sydney, Australia
i use the same figering on your scroe provided, but rather the lower printed version, starting with 4th finger on each semisemi quaver notes...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 9:50 am 
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Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2007 7:06 am
Posts: 65
Location: Israel/USA
johnmar78 wrote:
i use the same figering on your scroe provided, but rather the lower printed version, starting with 4th finger on each semisemi quaver notes...


That's exactly where "mixah" had a problem and started this question...

_________________
Best wishes,
Rami
http://pianofingering.tripod.com/
http://ramisrhapsody.tripod.com/
http://www.youtube.com/user/barniv
http://www.listen.to/rami


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 10:10 pm 
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Joined: Wed Aug 16, 2006 1:38 am
Posts: 647
Location: Sydney, Australia
well, i am ready for recoding this etude on video, and I have to say, I used the fingering recommended on the score, and its working for me. I am sorry that finger pattern does not suit into your playing styles.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 10:46 pm 
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Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2007 7:06 am
Posts: 65
Location: Israel/USA
johnmar78 wrote:
well, i am ready for recoding this etude on video, and I have to say, I used the fingering recommended on the score, and its working for me. I am sorry that finger pattern does not suit into your playing styles.


Glad the fingering in the score is working for you, but it didn't for "mixah" and doesn't for me. As a matter of fact, I never bother to look at fingering in scores, as I do my own.
I don't understand why you should be sorry that the fingering suggested in the score does not suit me, I am very happy with my own fingering and so are my students and my colleagues who come for advice.
I also hope you realize that different scores/editions of the same piece will give you different fingering.
As a matter of fact I am writing a book about advanced and virtuosic fingering.
Good luck with your recording, hope we can hear it on YouTube soon.

_________________
Best wishes,
Rami
http://pianofingering.tripod.com/
http://ramisrhapsody.tripod.com/
http://www.youtube.com/user/barniv
http://www.listen.to/rami


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