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 Post subject: Czerny...speed??
PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2006 8:16 pm 
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At which speed do you play czerny when you finish an etude.....I'm trying the first etudes of op.299, and i've made a midifile with the speed that czerny has written. for the first one 216 or s.th like that...well, i listened to it, and noticed that it is an amazing speed!!! i never will be able to reach this speed!! does this mean that theses etudes are too difficult for me? Has anyone made recordings of them??


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2006 6:31 am 
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His etudes are generally marked to be played very fast but have a simple structure. I believe that one can have as a final goal to play them in the indicated speed while very few people actually can do that.

If you take the first lesson as an example where a half-note is to be played 108 (b=216 as you say), playing 16:ths in that speed means that you need to hit 216/60*4 keys/second = 14.4 /keys per second.

While Czerny's lessons can be a great improvement to achieve speed, they can be terrible frustrating and can even do harm unless you do it right. Never feel tensed but rather focus on playing them correct but slow and speed will come naturally. It is not for certain that you ever will be able to play them in speed but I think (if you are inspired) you should continue try them out. I also believe that you should consult a teacher to help you approach them.

Remember, Czerny was Liszt's first "real" teacher so the exercises cannot be terrible wrong ;).

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2006 6:41 am 
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I think Czerny was (in)famous for his fast metronome marks. Just look at the speeds he prescribed in his edition of the Well Tempered Clavier. You should not feel too daunted by them. As Robert says it is more important to play thse etudes well at a speed you are comfortable with. Once that comes naturally, the speed can be increased little by little - if necessary, that is.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2006 11:23 am 
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techneut wrote:
I think Czerny was (in)famous for his fast metronome marks. Just look at the speeds he prescribed in his edition of the Well Tempered Clavier.

As well as the Bach Inventions. I think that the speed he suggests ruins much of the beauty and power in Bach. At least my brain gets bored with it.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2006 11:43 am 
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And wasn't Czerny a pupil of Beethoven, who was also (in)famous for his ridiculous metronome marks ? Makes me wonder how he (Beethoven) played the WTC.....

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2006 7:27 pm 
please don't follow those pedantically; it spoils the piece.

Play it until you believe you have a firm grasp of the piece, and that you learned some technical mastery from the piece - what more could you ask for?

I've played Czerny's 299 etudes, and I didn't even try to reach that speed. Just play some appropriate speed.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2006 7:45 pm 
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thanks for the answers, they helped me a lot :)


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 17, 2006 4:52 am 
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techneut wrote:
And wasn't Czerny a pupil of Beethoven, who was also (in)famous for his ridiculous metronome marks ? Makes me wonder how he (Beethoven) played the WTC.....

Actually, beethoven once stated "Who needs a metronome? You feel the speed." Perhaps he needed one after all ;).

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 22, 2006 6:00 pm 
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My teacher tells me to play Czerny ridiculous fast (and good of course). Because Czerny is not so musical she wants me to train to be able to play fast. The opposite of what she wants me to do with Bach. Maybe a Bach-good-and-comfortable-Czerny-ridiculous-fast-combination works....

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 22, 2006 8:10 pm 
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I think it helps your technique and assurance to be able to play things much faster than they should be played. The danger may be that it becomes a habit.

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