Piano Society
Free Classical Keyboard Recordings
It is currently Fri Dec 19, 2014 11:45 pm

All times are UTC - 1 hour




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 86 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2011 7:54 am 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2006 11:45 am
Posts: 9638
Location: Netherlands
pianolady wrote:
Wow, that's impressive! How do you find teacher lineage? Never mind, I'm sure you just have to read bios. I'm going to look for mine too.
I knew it went back to Lev Oborin, and Wikipedia provided the rest. Actually the line through my second teacher is intriguing too, and less convoluted: Folke Nauta - Jan Wijn - Alicia de Larrocha - Frank Marshall - Enrique Granados. Time to play more Spanish music again...

_________________
Nothing is always absolutely so -- Sturgeon's law
Chris Breemer


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2011 1:12 pm 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Wed Jun 14, 2006 12:38 pm
Posts: 8544
techneut wrote:
pianolady wrote:
Wow, that's impressive! How do you find teacher lineage? Never mind, I'm sure you just have to read bios. I'm going to look for mine too.
I knew it went back to Lev Oborin, and Wikipedia provided the rest. Actually the line through my second teacher is intriguing too, and less convoluted: Folke Nauta - Jan Wijn - Alicia de Larrocha - Frank Marshall - Enrique Granados. Time to play more Spanish music again...

OMG....really??? Ahhhhh!!!
(i want that lineage ¡!)

_________________
"Simplicity is the highest goal, achievable when you have overcome all difficulties." ~ Frederic Chopin

my videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/monicapiano
my personal website: http://www.monicaalianello.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2011 2:09 pm 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2006 11:45 am
Posts: 9638
Location: Netherlands
pianolady wrote:
OMG....really??? Ahhhhh!!!
(i want that lineage ¡!)

There must be someone in USA who studied with Larrocha. I never realized that Jan Wijn (the doyen of Dutch piano pedagogues) studied with her.
But this is getting terribly OT now...

_________________
Nothing is always absolutely so -- Sturgeon's law
Chris Breemer


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2011 2:52 pm 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Wed Jun 14, 2006 12:38 pm
Posts: 8544
88man wrote:
No Monica, it's not in my bio (sounds pretentious as an amateur). I only brought it up because Eddy brought back fond memories of my teacher...


I meant reading the bios of our teachers. I would never list that in my own bio either. But guess what? I have a similar line of teachers as you: Alexander Djordjevic :arrow: Vitali Margulis :arrow: Scriabin :arrow: Vasily Safonov :arrow: Leschetisky :arrow: Czerny :arrow: Beethoven (and Clementi).

_________________
"Simplicity is the highest goal, achievable when you have overcome all difficulties." ~ Frederic Chopin

my videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/monicapiano
my personal website: http://www.monicaalianello.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2011 3:08 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Apr 30, 2007 6:35 am
Posts: 1418
Location: Gulfport, MS, USA
techneut wrote:
But this is getting terribly OT now...

Has been for a while. I found the sketch of the tree my mom made for our teacher, and it's a little more complicated than I'd remembered (and all three lines were through Czerny - only two through Leschetizky).

Margaret Shaw-->Edwin Hughes-->Joseffy-->Liszt-->Czerny-->Beethoven-->Haydn etc.
''..........................''......................-->Leschetizky-->Czerny, etc.
''.....................-->Monetta Stribling Wells-->Ossip Gabrilowitsch-->Leschetizky, etc.

I don't know the tree for my other teachers, but I'm sure they have pedigree too. :roll: I do know that my current teacher studied with Abbey Simon; there's a rich pedigree there which I am too lazy to research. Another former teacher was a Juilliard grad.

_________________
"Z Czernym poznałem się na panie brat—na dwa fortepiana często z nim u niego grywałem. Dobry człowiek, ale nic więcej..." - Fryderyk Chopin


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2011 4:24 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2010 7:28 am
Posts: 1250
Location: Springfield, Missouri, USA
pianolady wrote:
88man wrote:
No Monica, it's not in my bio (sounds pretentious as an amateur). I only brought it up because Eddy brought back fond memories of my teacher...


I meant reading the bios of our teachers. I would never list that in my own bio either. But guess what? I have a similar line of teachers as you: Alexander Djordjevic :arrow: Vitali Margulis :arrow: Scriabin :arrow: Vasily Safonov :arrow: Leschetisky :arrow: Czerny :arrow: Beethoven (and Clementi).

Well what do you know? Monica and I are related :P ! V. Safonov was my great-grand teacher (through the line of both Lhevinnes, not Scriabin). BTW everyone (Chris are you listening?) anyone who traces back to Czerny and Beethoven, also goes back to JS Bach! Now that's what I'm talking about! Ok one other tidbit. While I was working on my MM degree, I discovered that Beethoven had written a little diddly (Hochzeitslied WoO 105) for the wedding of one Anna Ginastasio del Rio! She was the daughter of the Headmaster that Ludwig placed his nephew under. I have not been able to complete the line in my history since the family came from pre-communist Cuba, but I know it goes back to Spain. Maybe someday :(

_________________
Eddy M. del Rio, MD
"A smattering will not do. They must know all the keys, major and minor, and they must literally 'know them backwards.'" - Josef Lhevinne


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2011 5:30 pm 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Wed Jun 14, 2006 12:38 pm
Posts: 8544
musical-md wrote:
Well what do you know? Monica and I are related :P !

:lol: :lol:


musical-md wrote:
V. Safonov was my great-grand teacher (through the line of both Lhevinnes, not Scriabin). BTW everyone (Chris are you listening?) anyone who traces back to Czerny and Beethoven, also goes back to JS Bach! Now that's what I'm talking about! Ok one other tidbit. While I was working on my MM degree, I discovered that Beethoven had written a little diddly (Hochzeitslied WoO 105) for the wedding of one Anna Ginastasio del Rio! She was the daughter of the Headmaster that Ludwig placed his nephew under. (


Neato! I like hearing about this sort of thing.

_________________
"Simplicity is the highest goal, achievable when you have overcome all difficulties." ~ Frederic Chopin

my videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/monicapiano
my personal website: http://www.monicaalianello.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2011 6:10 pm 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Wed Jun 14, 2006 12:38 pm
Posts: 8544
OMG, OMG, OMG - Eddy! :shock: I'm freaking out a little - guess what I just heard on Performance Today? They talked about your ancestor except they called her Fanny del Rio. :shock: Supposedly, she had a crush on Beethoven. He was about 45 years old at the time, but didn't return her feelings because he was still in love with the 'mystery' woman. Wow!!!! You can hear it on the hour 2 of today's broadcast at around 41.00.

_________________
"Simplicity is the highest goal, achievable when you have overcome all difficulties." ~ Frederic Chopin

my videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/monicapiano
my personal website: http://www.monicaalianello.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2011 6:48 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2010 7:28 am
Posts: 1250
Location: Springfield, Missouri, USA
That's neat!
pianolady wrote:
They talked about your ancestor except they called her Fanny del Rio.
I wish I knew one way or the other! I believe that Fanny was a sister of Anna, both daughters of Headmaster Cajetan Gianastassio del Rio (Vienna).

_________________
Eddy M. del Rio, MD
"A smattering will not do. They must know all the keys, major and minor, and they must literally 'know them backwards.'" - Josef Lhevinne


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2011 9:17 pm 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2006 11:45 am
Posts: 9638
Location: Netherlands
pianolady wrote:
I meant reading the bios of our teachers. I would never list that in my own bio either. But guess what? I have a similar line of teachers as you: Alexander Djordjevic :arrow: Vitali Margulis :arrow: Scriabin :arrow: Vasily Safonov :arrow: Leschetisky :arrow: Czerny :arrow: Beethoven (and Clementi).

Pretty good. And all the spiffing yellow arrows as an added bonus.

_________________
Nothing is always absolutely so -- Sturgeon's law
Chris Breemer


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2011 9:27 pm 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2006 11:45 am
Posts: 9638
Location: Netherlands
musical-md wrote:
Well what do you know? Monica and I are related :P ! V. Safonov was my great-grand teacher (through the line of both Lhevinnes, not Scriabin). BTW everyone (Chris are you listening?)

Of course Eddy ! Sitting up and listening, and wagging the tail, actually :P

musical-md wrote:
anyone who traces back to Czerny and Beethoven, also goes back to JS Bach! Now that's what I'm talking about!

Alright, you win.

Though come to think of it, via my second teacher, I go back to Czerny too, via Jan Wijn, Bela Siki, Erno Dohnaniy, Eugen d'Albert, and Liszt. It's a bit far-fetched as Dohnanyi took only a couple of lessons with d'Albert - I guess he had very little to learn.

Now to see if anyone can trace back even further than Bach. Fun game, isn't it.

_________________
Nothing is always absolutely so -- Sturgeon's law
Chris Breemer


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2011 11:32 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Apr 30, 2007 6:35 am
Posts: 1418
Location: Gulfport, MS, USA
It's apparently more fun than playing Czerny.

_________________
"Z Czernym poznałem się na panie brat—na dwa fortepiana często z nim u niego grywałem. Dobry człowiek, ale nic więcej..." - Fryderyk Chopin


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2011 11:45 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2010 7:28 am
Posts: 1250
Location: Springfield, Missouri, USA
techneut wrote:
musical-md wrote:
Well what do you know? Monica and I are related :P ! V. Safonov was my great-grand teacher (through the line of both Lhevinnes, not Scriabin). BTW everyone (Chris are you listening?)

Of course Eddy ! Sitting up and listening, and wagging the tail, actually :P

musical-md wrote:
anyone who traces back to Czerny and Beethoven, also goes back to JS Bach! Now that's what I'm talking about!

Alright, you win.

Though come to think of it, via my second teacher, I go back to Czerny too, via Jan Wijn, Bela Siki, Erno Dohnaniy, Eugen d'Albert, and Liszt. It's a bit far-fetched as Dohnanyi took only a couple of lessons with d'Albert - I guess he had very little to learn.

Now to see if anyone can trace back even further than Bach. Fun game, isn't it.

I had the pleasure of knowing Bela Siki while I was in Cincinnati; a truely fabulous artist!

_________________
Eddy M. del Rio, MD
"A smattering will not do. They must know all the keys, major and minor, and they must literally 'know them backwards.'" - Josef Lhevinne


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2011 4:06 am 
Offline

Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2008 4:17 pm
Posts: 418
Location: Boston
"All In The Family!" Looks like we're ALL related: Me, Chris, Eddy, Monica, Terez! :shock:
Very interesting backgrounds everyone.
Now, only if we could live up to playing as good as the teachers in our musical lineages. :( (I speak for myself)

Monica, how many years have you studied with Djordjevic?... He's a great Liszt interpreter; I am surprised that you don't play more Liszt?... I studied with mine for 9 years until 2nd year in college, then reality set in...

techneut wrote:
Now to see if anyone can trace back even further than Bach. Fun game, isn't it.
Terez wrote:
It's apparently more fun than playing Czerny.
:lol: :lol: That's Classic! (no pun intended)

_________________
"Nobility of spirit has more to do with simplicity than ostentation, wisdom rather than wealth, commitment rather than ambition." ~Riccardo Muti


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2011 11:50 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Apr 30, 2007 6:35 am
Posts: 1418
Location: Gulfport, MS, USA
88man wrote:
"All In The Family!" Looks like we're ALL related: Me, Chris, Eddy, Monica, Terez! :shock:
Very interesting backgrounds everyone.
Now, only if we could live up to playing as good as the teachers in our musical lineages. :( (I speak for myself)

lol, you could probably speak for all of us. Now I just wish I could trace my lineage back to Chopin - that's harder to do!

_________________
"Z Czernym poznałem się na panie brat—na dwa fortepiana często z nim u niego grywałem. Dobry człowiek, ale nic więcej..." - Fryderyk Chopin


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2011 12:59 pm 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2006 11:45 am
Posts: 9638
Location: Netherlands
Terez wrote:
lol, you could probably speak for all of us. Now I just wish I could trace my lineage back to Chopin - that's harder to do!

Get some lessons from Charles Rosen while he's still here. Or find one of his pupils, there must be some.

_________________
Nothing is always absolutely so -- Sturgeon's law
Chris Breemer


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2011 2:26 pm 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Wed Jun 14, 2006 12:38 pm
Posts: 8544
88man wrote:
"All In The Family!" Looks like we're ALL related: Me, Chris, Eddy, Monica, Terez! :shock:
Very interesting backgrounds everyone.
Now, only if we could live up to playing as good as the teachers in our musical lineages. :( (I speak for myself)

Monica, how many years have you studied with Djordjevic?... He's a great Liszt interpreter; I am surprised that you don't play more Liszt?... I studied with mine for 9 years until 2nd year in college, then reality set in...


I said it before...we are like a little family here. Guess I'm the mom. :lol:

Anyway, I studied with Alexander for about 3 years. It was recently - my taking lessons again after a long break. You're right about him being a great Liszt interpreter. His last CD was the 2010 recipient of the Hungarian Liszt Society’s 35th Annual Franz Liszt International Grand Prix du Disque. I went with him when he recorded it. Very interesting experience! And I did play a few Liszt pieces while studying with him. But he introduced me to lots of other pieces that I never knew about, plus I was constantly bringing in my own pieces that I wanted him to teach me and so we just never had enough time to play everything....
I've stopped the lessons currently, but now that I'm comfortable in my new routine, maybe I can start up again. I'd love that! There is still plenty he can teach me!!

_________________
"Simplicity is the highest goal, achievable when you have overcome all difficulties." ~ Frederic Chopin

my videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/monicapiano
my personal website: http://www.monicaalianello.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2011 3:35 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2010 7:28 am
Posts: 1250
Location: Springfield, Missouri, USA
pianolady wrote:
said it before...we are like a little family here. Guess I'm the mom.

No way! More like the ... mistress :wink:

_________________
Eddy M. del Rio, MD
"A smattering will not do. They must know all the keys, major and minor, and they must literally 'know them backwards.'" - Josef Lhevinne


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2011 3:38 pm 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2006 11:45 am
Posts: 9638
Location: Netherlands
More like the Agony Aunt :P

_________________
Nothing is always absolutely so -- Sturgeon's law
Chris Breemer


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2011 3:44 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2010 7:28 am
Posts: 1250
Location: Springfield, Missouri, USA
:lol: :lol: :lol:

_________________
Eddy M. del Rio, MD
"A smattering will not do. They must know all the keys, major and minor, and they must literally 'know them backwards.'" - Josef Lhevinne


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2011 4:29 pm 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Wed Jun 14, 2006 12:38 pm
Posts: 8544
hmmm...ok.

_________________
"Simplicity is the highest goal, achievable when you have overcome all difficulties." ~ Frederic Chopin

my videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/monicapiano
my personal website: http://www.monicaalianello.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2011 5:04 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Apr 30, 2007 6:35 am
Posts: 1418
Location: Gulfport, MS, USA
At least you're not the redheaded stepchild.

_________________
"Z Czernym poznałem się na panie brat—na dwa fortepiana często z nim u niego grywałem. Dobry człowiek, ale nic więcej..." - Fryderyk Chopin


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2011 5:05 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Apr 30, 2007 6:35 am
Posts: 1418
Location: Gulfport, MS, USA
techneut wrote:
Terez wrote:
lol, you could probably speak for all of us. Now I just wish I could trace my lineage back to Chopin - that's harder to do!

Get some lessons from Charles Rosen while he's still here. Or find one of his pupils, there must be some.

Can't I just claim that Liszt studied with Chopin?

_________________
"Z Czernym poznałem się na panie brat—na dwa fortepiana często z nim u niego grywałem. Dobry człowiek, ale nic więcej..." - Fryderyk Chopin


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 9:11 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Apr 30, 2007 6:35 am
Posts: 1418
Location: Gulfport, MS, USA
10/12 is coming along quite nicely. Most of it really is easy, but there are a few LH bits that are just brutal. Mostly they just need practice, but I'm having a hard time figuring out the proper hand position to make this work:

Image

Any advice would be appreciated.

_________________
"Z Czernym poznałem się na panie brat—na dwa fortepiana często z nim u niego grywałem. Dobry człowiek, ale nic więcej..." - Fryderyk Chopin


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Sun Aug 14, 2011 2:17 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Dec 27, 2010 1:11 am
Posts: 243
Location: Adelaide, Australia
Can you describe exactly where/what the problem is? Most people don't rate this as one of the more difficult parts; the section starting in G sharp minor usually causes more trouble.

_________________
Alexander Hanysz, http://hanysz.net


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Chopin etudes op 10/25
PostPosted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 2:12 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Apr 30, 2007 6:35 am
Posts: 1418
Location: Gulfport, MS, USA
hanysz wrote:
Can you describe exactly where/what the problem is? Most people don't rate this as one of the more difficult parts; the section starting in G sharp minor usually causes more trouble.

Indeed, that part causes more trouble. But I think I've figured it out (that is, the bit I asked about) - it just requires a certain lightness and direction that I had to work out. I've mostly got this one down; I might post a practice recording of it in this thread in a week or so, along with 10/1, which is coming along. I'm also starting to get the hang of 10/4, now that I've figured out the right fingerings (I understand now why Nathan compared it to 10/2). 10/3 is also coming along so I might post practice recordings of all four next week (10/1, 3, 4, and 12). I'm spending less time on 10/2 for now, but still working on it a little, along with the Op. 25 etudes (1, 6, 7, 11, and 12).

_________________
"Z Czernym poznałem się na panie brat—na dwa fortepiana często z nim u niego grywałem. Dobry człowiek, ale nic więcej..." - Fryderyk Chopin


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 86 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2

All times are UTC - 1 hour


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group